... Or how to get past Chargen without selling your soul.

Rather than hijack Tears thread, here's a new one to complain/whine/annoy/protest/agree/praise/whatever on. 

Previous threads:
http://shadowrun.dnaco.net/forum/index.php/topic,299.0.html
http://shadowrun.dnaco.net/forum/index.php/topic,392.0.html
http://shadowrun.dnaco.net/forum/index.php/topic,97.0.html
And probably a couple others.

We may be relaxing standards when it comes to approving backgrounds, but there are still certain things that we look for.  Being able to understand it is one, and having a plausable concept. Here's a couple hints of what I look for and tips on how to make chargen easier.

1.  Fifty pages of a background does not guarantee approval and we are NOT looking for the bestest writing in the whole wide world.  If you write fifty pages and the concept behind it isn't sound, then it won't be approved.  Fifty pages detailing how your character was the CEO of Aztechnology, knew Prez Dunk personally, and slept with Captain Chaos will get rejected just the same as 'I iz good!'.  Whether five pages of merely answering questions in order or fifty pages of story, it's not the quality of the writing it's the content.

2.  Arguing with Staff will not get your unapprovable BG approved.  We don't want to make your character for you, but there are things that won't work or things that are too crazy to allow.  Just because you want a character that was the CEO of Aztechnology and the concept doesn't work without being the CEO of a major corp doesn't mean that we have to allow it.  Nor does it mean that pulling aside Staff for discussion without compromising anything will get you what you want.

3.  A shadowrunner does NOT have to be a victim.  You may find it fun to write about rape and abuse and such things, it may even be theme, but not everyone is a victim.  And please keep in mind that we may not want to read about the gory details of such things. That doesn't mean it can't happen to your character and it is a situation that can have a definite effect on a character, but please gloss over the actual scene and details.  Fade to Black, even in a BG, is a good thing.  And after reading about how you're doing such horrible things to your character, yes, we get a little burnt out after the fifteenth in a row please understand why we may be less than enthusiatic about it.

4.  If we don't like your background and character, it does NOT mean we don't like you. 

5.  We try to give suggestions when we find something that doesn't fit, and we try to give more than one example of other things. That does not mean you have to use one of those examples (see hint number 2), but it is given as a way to help you think of other things to do.  Whatever we suggest is, once again, a suggestion. 

6. Yes, we may be slightly masochistic, but that isn't the only reason why we choose to be Mentors/Player Help Staff.  All the horrible little scenes people put on over their backgrounds are made up for by the new players that we help get settled in who show enthusiasm.  It also makes up for those awesome two page backgrounds that once read, can be approved on the spot. 

7. RPStaff gets props for running scenes and getting things done quickly and doing stuff while PHS doesn't often get recognition for the work they put in.  And that's not just dealing with backgrounds.  So before you go bitching about how we won't let your CEO of Aztech on the grid, just chill out for a minute and refer to hint number 2 again.

There are more, but that's what I'm thinking at the moment.

Can we app angsty anti-social post-op transexual hermaphrodites who impregnant themselves to avoid having to deal with a significant other? Pretty please? I want to describe myself like Tim Curry's character from the Rocky Horror Picture Show when going out on runs.??

This is to me the most important part of the approval process.  If something won't fly, then fine.  It just sucks when staffers are like "Nope," without telling you what might actually work instead...

So I was wondering... Would it be possible to take an allergy to blood (uncommon) and have it actually work as a phobia?? ie a character suffers the same symptoms of a moderate allergy because of their extreme out-freaking if they get it on them?

And, for that matter, will there be any room for using allergies as phobias?? It makes sense, I could say that my mild allergy to dogs is actually a fear of them, so the penalty is from seeing them rather than smelling them.? Or my moderate allergy to seawater might be because I fear it since it killed my father, and raped my mother!

Eh?? Do I get any love on the allergy = phobia idea??

Makes sense to me.

I'd take it to another thread, Tear.  But the idea is... eh. 

I was thinking the same thing while looking at allergy. A 2 dice penalty when near it? Sounds like it could be a good phobia to me...but I won't hijack the thread.

I'm sort of  about how they slimmed down the edges and flaws.   They got rid of most of the retarded ones that shouldn't be worth points like distinctive style and vindictive and color blind, but...  If they wanted to save pages, they should have replaced allergy with 'aversion', and allowed you to describe it however you want.  Same points structure, but an aversion could be an allergy, phobia, hypnotic suggestion, psychotic delusion, etc.  The problem there is that they couldn't have been as specific about the ill effects like how allergies damage you and stuff, but it's silly that you can make characters that are allergic to stuff but they can't have major mental disorders ;_;

Oh no.  You can give them serious mental disorders, you just don't get any points for it.  Mental disorders are fun.  It's just more a decision on whether you want to play a character or if you want to play a sheet.   

Yes, this is New Seattle MU*, not trying to write officially for Shadowrun Online Fiction. You are not required to include a canon character in every story like fanpro(now Catlyst GameLabs) required. Which is GOOD!


I am staff on a WoD MU*...I will work with players to get them approvable..soemtimes, it is alot of work...sometimes I wish I had a telephonic death ray...Something I believe is that there is compromise on both sides. But that is just me..I do not like not aproving a character, especially when I can tell the player has put alot of work into it. However, if someone throws something together, writes a two paragraph background..you can rest assured I am going to say "Hey..um..I need more detail, OK?"


Also, some players and staffers do not like dealing with that stuff. Honestly, I have used it only one character on a MU*...ever. and I have been playing MU*s for 12 years.  Personally, I like inspiration from Robin Hood, or other more heroic sources. I like playing characters who have a reason to run the Shadows that is not the tired old 'Revenge' or 'for the thrill of it' or 'it is the only thing I can do.' Personally, though, I think writing a background is both the most fun, and most frustrating part of chargen, and as a staffer, I both love and hate reading backgrounds. I love it when it is well written. I hate it when...I am wanting to go 'Say what?!' Believabily, some semblance of grammar, and an absensce of l33t speak..those are things I find so...rarely.


YES! Thank you guy for reiterating this! I hate it when people think I have a problem with them because I did not approve them because of their background..(especially the time someone wrote a long background, and there was one element that I felt was important that they glossed over,a nd I asked for a little more detail on that)


And, of course, a suggestion some times inspires the player in a different way..yes, suggestions are important as they cans tart the player thinking outside the box they might have written themselves into and not realized it.


And, of course, the background itself really doesn't matter as much as the purpose of wriging the background: to figure out your character. A well written long background may be as good as well written short background..but, in the end, a background that doesn't tell me about your character is never going to be approved by me..I try to never write a background I wouldn't approve..so, it always helps to think like this: would you approve that background if you were a staffer? Why or why not?


Actually, generally speaking, staffing in general is a thankless job...you do it because youlove the game, not becaus eof any rewards you might get. Rarely will a player even say "Thank you for the help!" You guys, despite nothaving the MU* up yet, have been doing great...even when there are the idiots who flame and troll...I look forward to getting to see you all in action!

To Tear:

The first thing I want to tell you about is game systems.  You may not see a difference in the game whether or not an allergy is present instead of a phobia, but as a person who intuitively finds system holes to break, I always look for them and a good reason as to why something may have been worded one way instead of another.  I'll give you an example.  Its dark, you have -8 to all your sight tests, its in a sewer and you are phobic to rats.  The GM has one of two choices, they can say the potential of rats being in the area makes your phobia start working, and if you wanted to you could bitch about that, or if you were a good player you'd let it slide, but if every sewer you went into had no real rats to see/hear and you were being phobic of it all the time it'd seem a lot like the GM was picking on you.  With multiple GMs who can't be sure when your flaw was last picked on they come into more complications.  An allergy to rats would be a no duh situation in that instance.  Whether or not you can see them, the rats are giving you a penalty cause they DO frequent this environment and there would be enough hair/dander/etc in the area to cause most allergies to start up.  This becomes more prominent to things like gold.  Sure, you might not have an electronics background so you might not know most computer components have gold in them, and you're holding an electronic device.  You wouldn't be afraid of it, but depending on your allergy severity you might start having symptoms that you can't explain.  Allergy to Sea Water versus phobia.  You drink a cup of water from a tavern and its sea water, tastes salty and bad, could just be salt water.  But, its the stuff in sea water, not just the sat, that makes most people allergic to it.  All the various chemicals coming from fish, etc.  So, you drink a cup of salt water and have no reaction, you'd be afraid of it anyways if you were severely allergic but you wouldn't break out so you'd know it was safe (no dice penalty).  If it actually IS sea water, you break out even if you think its just salt water.

The player has a lot more control, and the system mechanics have to be tweaked more.  You see a four-legged shape run across the ground... dog or cat?  Size, could be either, you figure cause of where you are its a cat (no penalty if afraid of dogs).  Its a dog though, so the allergic person gets the penalty even though they can't make it out that clearly.  Aversions are easily twinkable, allergies are less so. Allergies are easier to use as a GM because some locations call for some kind of pet/material/etc to be present where as with aversions you'd have to make sure the particular character learned of the stuff in order to use it in the plot, and they'd have to have the sensory ability, or knowledge to know about the material.  Aversion to steel, in a car junk yard.  Well, if they think all cars are made of plastic, they have an intelligence of 1, and they have no supporting Background skill, but there's one or two old cars in the area that are most definitely made of steel instead of plastics... why it'd be hard as a GM to get that across to the player to make their flaw work.  I might, just to get points on a low int character, take aversions to things so complicated that it'd be hard for me to even notice them in the environment.  If I did the same with Allergies I'd be hurting myself even MORE, cause I wouldn't know not to go into the junkyard with all that steel around.

Allergies are worth points, aversions are character quirks that you don't get points for and shouldn't.
/End To Tear

Suggestions to Players who wish to get through the door as fast as possible and get down to what we are here for... RP.


Never, and I mean never, submit a story background when they let you answer questions.  When questions are answered and staff review them, you merely have to change the few answers they have issues with.  Also, try and make each answer to each question not rely on any of the other specifics in any of the other answers.  As long as you have a consistent feel to your character it will get approved, and this means less retyping later.  If you REALLY wanna write a story, do so, but keep it to pass around to friends, to help you delve into your character more, to give as a treat to other players who really like your character... etc.  As BGs, stories are never as easy to get approved as answers to questions.  If an answering system is not in place, then write a story.  Be as short as possible, but never under a page, for some reasons less than 1 page is an immediate no-no even with a place with no page minimum.  Most people just don't think you can fit enough information for a full character into a page or less.  2 pages is my recommendation and if you go over 2, make sure you read it over again to find spelling errors and grammatical errors.  2 pages or under you should read again ANYWAYS, but if there's only 2 errors you'll get approved, above 2 pages you are likely to continue making mistakes which will make the staffer KNOW you didn't re-read it, and feel like you are using them for corrections.  Despite any stipulations otherwise, quality of writing is key to a good story based background.  Bad writing, no matter what form, is rarely approvable.  You don't have to be super fantastic, but you wanna be decent.  Again, if you can write answers to questions do so, it naturally breaks up flow which means you don't have to try and maintain it throughout a short story.


Never argue with an approving admin.  They will take longer to approve you cause you are being a jerk.  Answering questions makes you less inclined to yell back because your concept isn't also your art.  You will be less invested in a questions and answers BG than you will a story one, so you are more open to changes.  Always change what the staffer wants you to change if they will be the one reviewing it again, and always follow their suggestions to a T, as far as BG content is concerned, and just tweak it a little, not a lot, just a little.  As far as your +sheet is concerned, suggestions are never that, they are almost always requirements.  If they want you to drop a 5 to a 4, but don't care about the specializations you have, do so and specialize in what you wanted to use.  They get what they want, the 4 skill, and you get the 6 dice.  Also, if they want you to drop a 5 to a 3, drop it to a 4, they'll approve it... trust me.  Never be a part of any canon stuff, always make up your own corps, businesses, etc inside of your own BGs.  It prevents any kind of thematic arguments against use of said corp/business, and makes it so you still get the concept you want.  Never be the head of any organization unless that organization is a handful of people or less, at which point you aren't even a gang so there is no worries about power levels.  Anyone who is a part of your organization take as contacts, no matter how low, take them... it always looks better, is noticed, and is considered not to be twinking... otherwise the people in your small organization will be looked at as you trying to get contacts for no BPs.  Do not argue that you will not use them as contacts, again do not argue with an approving staffer... ever.  Your BG will take more time to get approved, and the person will be more stubborn about the suggestions they want.  Take what they say, smile, and change minor specifics to keep your overall concept.


Make whatever the hell you want.  If you make it a victim, it will get approved, if you don't, it will still. In fact, you might be more easily approved if you do make your character a victim.  The staffer has probably personally approved a million others like you and will do so again, why?  Cause they'd feel guilty not to do so, and its hard to disapprove someone who's perfectly fine in all other regards simply because of a personal disagreement with some manner of suffering in your BG.  Don't make it Rape, if you wanna be a rape victim, wait until you are on the grid to include that.  In fact, the best way to do a victim based character is to simply leave out the details of their parents dying/etc, and use it just as IC information once on the grid.  There's millions of things about your character that won't come out until you are actually on the grid.  Rape victims are almost never taken seriously ICly, so if you are going to do it make sure you are considered a fantastic RPer before you bring it up ICly.  Otherwise, you will get people who don't wanna talk about it, or are only trying to talk about it with your character for some IC TLC.  Fade to Blacks are the best things ever, including like forced cybernetic limbs, or things like that.  Don't describe the surgery, instead describe waking up with the limbs changed... that way its a shock.  In the end, cliches are cliches because we like them, deep down they are the things that make us shine or cry and so there's a soft spot for fanstastically done cliches and ther's a stubbornness against anyone who attempts to do it and isn't so great at it... but in either situation you'll find it easier to get approved as a cliche then you will as something brand new and perhaps a bit awry because of that.


It doesn't.  At all.  Never take anyone's IC comments about you, or system comments about your character as personal disagreements with you.  Instead, just do what the staffer suggests, get to the grid, and build from there.  After all, the faster you can get onto the grid the sooner you can start getting Karma, and having fun RPing.


Despite the examples ever given, remember the goal, to get on grid.  If they give you multiple examples it means you can tweak more and think less.  Use them, combine them, mutate them a little and put them in your BG.  It'll seem creative, you know that particular staffer already likes the idea, and it means you don't have to recreate anything... they've done the beginning work for you.


Notice the choice in page amounts.  Notice that enthusiasm is a thing to show, and notice that disagreements are described as horrible little scenes.  Never argue with staffers approving your BG.  They hold all the keys to all the doors to get on grid.  Play the game of BG making, get on grid, and become a truly wonderful RPer... you can't do that if you are spending all your time in chargen trying to make your BG perfect, or all encompassing, or something completely original.  But, once on grid you can do that with your character in no time and have fun doing it.  If you like writing BGs, and being in chargen more than on the grid, then fine spend all the time you need and I hope you die often so you can do what you like most again and again.  But, for those of us who come to a MUX to RP, get through the hoops as fast as possible with as few of casaulties as possible.  And, practice writing if you are going to do a story, to make that awesome two pages come to life.


Again, to re-iterate.  Never argue with your approving staffer.  Do what they suggest with minor tweaks.  Be willing to adjust your character sheet, but never as much as they want you to so you don't lose your concept (you can make it back with karma).  Take their suggestions as requirements.  Do not write stories if you can avoid it, if you do write a story keep it to 2 pages.  Change what they suggest, always.  Check spelling and grammar, don't argue about those, change them.  In the end, try and get on grid as fast as possible with as few alterations to your character sheet as possible.  Once you are there, if you are a good RPer, no one will care about how bad/short/etc your background was or how cliche your concept... they will love you and want to RP with you and any future character you make.  If this is your second character and you made a first one that everyone liked, they you will get through the door with less suggestions even if just as bad of a written BG, so spend less time on figuring out the BG and more time on figuring out a +sheet that will get approved.  Then, zip through.

You lost me at two pages of reply.

Edit, edit, cut it down!

Coincidentally, I'm not sure what you're trying to say about Allergies/Flaws, but I probably disagree with you.

NES is saying aversions are based upon the character's mental state whereas allergies are not. Someone with an aversion to peanuts may eat a candybar and suffer no ill effects because they do not realize it contains peanuts. Meanwhile, another ignorant character with a severe peanut allergy just skips straight ahead to anaphylactic shock when they eat the same bar. Big difference. Allergies cannot be defeated via willfull ignorance on the part of the player, nor will the mere suspicion of an allergen give your character a rash. Aversions, on the other hand, are very open to interpretation.